> We offer flexible working arrangements where the role allows. This role can be based at our offices in Swindon, or worked on a hybrid pattern. You will be required to attend our Swindon offices 1 day per week.
And that includes London, it lists "excluding London" as £65k.
People overestimate how much senior devs in the UK earn, even after knowing they're not well paid, my usual response to hearing we should be earning £90k+ is, "well give us a job then"!
A friend is making about £180k / yr in London, and they bought a house recently in London. I think that's a lot, and his wife also makes a similar amount, slightly more. That seems to be the minimum, otherwise you're a renter for life. Pretty nuts.
I'm afraid that won't even get a foot in the door in this market. You must have at least 5 years experience managing Salisbury megaliths to meet the selection criteria.
God, I had that entire Dress To Kill show loaded up on my old timey mp3-player along with Definite Article, Glorious and Sexie. Barely any room for music, but I was giggling my way through every day trying not to look too insane in public.
Izzard probably rewired my brain more than any other single comedian.
Technically Stonehenge is not an henge (even the term henge comes from Stonehenge)
> Ironically, even though Stonehenge has an earthwork circle around it (the earliest phase of the monument), it isn’t officially a ‘proper’ henge, as the main ditch is external to the main bank. It has to make do with being a ‘proto-henge’.
I was slightly disappointed when I first visited Stonehenge as the standard tours keep you fairly far away and roped off.
But, I took a modestly more expensive "Inner Stones" tour a few months ago and lucked out being selected to be fully alone for a minute. It was a profound experience being in the middle of such a historic place.
Best of all go during the summer solstice when there is free public access. It’s really quite fun.
During the the 1980s and ‘90s there were regular clashes between new age hippies and police stopping them from reaching Stonehenge during summer solstice before public access was allowed.
I highly recommend avebury, about 20 minutes down the road. Absolutely enormous megalithic complex, huge man-made hill, and you can just wander where you wish, go hug a menhir, whatever you fancy - and there’s hardly ever more than a handful of other people there. Oh and it’s free.
You must have gone at a quiet time. Avebury can be absolutely heaving in the Summer and on the traditional pagan quarter days.
It also has a pub, a restaurant, a gift shop, a museum founded by a marmalade magnate, and if you're really rich you can buy one of the houses inside the circle.
Generally a happier experience than Stonehenge.
If megalithic rocks are your thing there's also the nearby West Kennet Longbarrow, which is far more likely to be deserted, especially at night, although if you go on the quarter days (nights) you'll probably meet weirdly-dressed people lighting candles and throwing spells around.
Due to a typo in the paperwork sent to HR by the hiring manager, they are only paying 64,189 pence. The director was last heard chastising HR, saying "It's not your job to be as confused as Nigel."
I caught a live stream of Stonehenge during this past Winter Solstice (it was cloudy, naturally) and the streamer provided a bit of trivia that I hadn't heard before:
George Washington's English ancestors, specifically Sir Lawrence Washington, were the owners of the West Amesbury Estate in Wiltshire, England, which included the land where the ancient Stonehenge monument sits. (Via Google)
If you hadn't that before, welcome to the "Huh, that's a funny coincidence" club.
Land owners also had married within family so I you checked their family tree two persons could be simultaneously spouses and cousins. That's a coincidence!
Considering the location, I would imagine that the ancestors prefer to haunt the barrows at night. Still a dream job if that's your thing. Just watch out for the occasional Nazgûl. :)
The median income in the UK is currently sitting at £2,627 / week or £31,524 / year [1]. This is advertising more than double that at £64,189, not quite graduate wages!
They don't look for rock stars. English heritage wants ideology:
"You can connect with others through our EDI networks as a member or ally. These include Ethnic Diversity, Faith & Belief, Social Equity, LGBTQ+, Neurodivergence, Age, Disability and Gender Health and Wellbeing."
(Should have mentioned Talibans, handy to blow up misplaced stones)
36 hours per week. 25 days vacation (going to 28). Pension contributions. You can buy extra leave. Epic location, fun job, decent salary for the UK (where e.g. you don't pay for healthcare)...
This is a decent salary for a heritage job. It is a very poorly-paid sector. On building sites with archaeological excavations, the person driving the digger is likely to be paid more than the archaeologists, who probably have postgraduate degrees.
UK tech salaries are also not high. And 64k pounds for a history and/or business major is quite right. Do not forget also: history is a overrun study with many people afterwards driving taxis
The UK has had substantially less wage inequality than the US for a long time. The UK “wage squeeze” is median/minimum wage which has gone from the 1/3 to 2/3 since ~2000 as the minimum wage has been raised. But the relevant difference here would be around 90th percentile/median which is 1.85 in UK vs 2.4 in US and even higher in California.
The UK is still the 5th biggest economy in the world. Public infrastructure feels like it's under huge strain however, and there is also a big problem with inequality, which seems to be changing under Labour, albeit slowly.
Raw economy size can be misleading in two ways. The value of a dollar is much less or much more depending on where you're at. So an economy of 10 shekels might mean an economy of 100 widgets, or it might mean an economy of 1 widget. Purchasing power parity (PPP) attempts to account for that. The second is that economies are largely a product of population. An economy of a million making a million shekels is quite a bit different than an economy of 10 making a million shekels, so you also want to look at per capita values. Even both of these adjustments combined [1] can be extremely misleading (see: Ireland and many other places...), but they provide at least a less unreasonable basis for comparison than nominal dollars. And the UK is currently 30th there.
I think GDP per capita can also be misleading though - the GDP per capita of Luxembourg or Brunei is high, but they're such small countries that it's kind of irrelevant.
Setting aside the special cases (tiny, oil money, weird finance sectors, tax havens etc) there's basically a handful of countries which are clearly doing something right - the US, Taiwan, the north-eastern European countries (Germany, Austria, Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Sweden). Most of the other "developed countries" are sitting in the same sort of GDP per capita range of $65-$75k. Ranking these isn't so meaningful - the difference between the UK and France is only 1.5%.
While true from a per capita equivalency and too close for comfort, the median net worth of an adult in the UK is roughly $150,000, while in Mississippi it's $15,000. Also, its public services are provided, which substantially affects the quality of life.
It's not a "good" wage in the US. It's exactly median.
Which is fine, someone has to be median, but really underwhelming for the (presumably highly-educated and talented) head of the #1 national historical monument.
And don't you knock of at lunch on Fridays anyways? So that's like a 4 day work week, because let's face it, you're not really doing anything on the day you're knocking off early anyways. See you at the pub!
Their senior solution architect vacancy has similar pay: https://www.english-heritage.org.uk/about/our-people/careers...
Somewhat less eminent job title though.
> We offer flexible working arrangements where the role allows. This role can be based at our offices in Swindon, or worked on a hybrid pattern. You will be required to attend our Swindon offices 1 day per week.
Pretty decent flexibility though.
I would love to have "Stonehenge architect" as a job title.
They really miss out on opportunities here.
that is abysmal!
That's a fairly standard wage outside London for senior developers.
UK wages are not great.
The balancing force to this though, is that cost of living outside of London is massively lower
i wouldn't call that standard wage, rather the lowest end of the spectrum where you could theoretically shop a "senior" outside of london.
Median senior dev salary is £70k according to recent job postings: https://www.itjobswatch.co.uk/jobs/uk/senior%20developer.do
And that includes London, it lists "excluding London" as £65k.
People overestimate how much senior devs in the UK earn, even after knowing they're not well paid, my usual response to hearing we should be earning £90k+ is, "well give us a job then"!
A friend is making about £180k / yr in London, and they bought a house recently in London. I think that's a lot, and his wife also makes a similar amount, slightly more. That seems to be the minimum, otherwise you're a renter for life. Pretty nuts.
As a senior dev?
What sector?
A product lead/architect in Finance.
Probably FANG or finance.
As a Finnish dev with 12 years of experience, I can only aspire for such salary.
Are you serious? Sarcasm Don't translate well on internet.
He's serious. American programming salaries are an extreme outlier. You guys are in for a massive shock if they ever normalise.
Or in the next few years as AI devours the profession.
Maybe you missed the “25% discount in our shops and cafes” perk for the day you need to be in the office. Score.
Wait till you see UK wages, when it's the UK arm of a US firm....
wait till you hear about the stock grants and vesting schedule
Be warned though, the equity you are granted will be exceedingly illiquid.
And you'll have to pay taxes on it despite it being unsellable.
Screw those things up, and those taxes will bankrupt you because they can exceed all your other earnings.
* Must be proficient in use of mistletoe in unspecified rituals.
* Must provide own sickle, and robes.
"From £64,189 p.a. depending on skills and experience"
I maintained a collection of well organized rocks as a child. Surely that gets me a bit more than base pay right?
Must be a rockstar
There's got to be a way to shoehorn in a Spinal Tap reference here, I just haven't had enough coffee yet to think of it.
The height of the stones goes to 13!
I'm afraid that won't even get a foot in the door in this market. You must have at least 5 years experience managing Salisbury megaliths to meet the selection criteria.
even if you grind lots of leet-stone problems?
RE Your predecessor
No one knows who he was, or what he was doing.
But his legacy remains hewn in the HR dock of Stonehenge.
Some say he was let go after a design error lead to some dwarves kicking over the first stonehenge.
Damnit. No WFH option.
Unless Stonehenge is your home
“Work From Henge”
Building a henge, are we?
You bastards, you never told me 200 miles. 200 miles in this day and age! I don't even know where I live now!
I wish the Christians would hurry up and get here
God, I had that entire Dress To Kill show loaded up on my old timey mp3-player along with Definite Article, Glorious and Sexie. Barely any room for music, but I was giggling my way through every day trying not to look too insane in public.
Izzard probably rewired my brain more than any other single comedian.
Technically Stonehenge is not an henge (even the term henge comes from Stonehenge)
> Ironically, even though Stonehenge has an earthwork circle around it (the earliest phase of the monument), it isn’t officially a ‘proper’ henge, as the main ditch is external to the main bank. It has to make do with being a ‘proto-henge’.
https://www.english-heritage.org.uk/visit/inspire-me/what-is...
I was slightly disappointed when I first visited Stonehenge as the standard tours keep you fairly far away and roped off.
But, I took a modestly more expensive "Inner Stones" tour a few months ago and lucked out being selected to be fully alone for a minute. It was a profound experience being in the middle of such a historic place.
Highly, highly recommended!
Best of all go during the summer solstice when there is free public access. It’s really quite fun.
During the the 1980s and ‘90s there were regular clashes between new age hippies and police stopping them from reaching Stonehenge during summer solstice before public access was allowed.
I highly recommend avebury, about 20 minutes down the road. Absolutely enormous megalithic complex, huge man-made hill, and you can just wander where you wish, go hug a menhir, whatever you fancy - and there’s hardly ever more than a handful of other people there. Oh and it’s free.
You must have gone at a quiet time. Avebury can be absolutely heaving in the Summer and on the traditional pagan quarter days.
It also has a pub, a restaurant, a gift shop, a museum founded by a marmalade magnate, and if you're really rich you can buy one of the houses inside the circle.
Generally a happier experience than Stonehenge.
If megalithic rocks are your thing there's also the nearby West Kennet Longbarrow, which is far more likely to be deserted, especially at night, although if you go on the quarter days (nights) you'll probably meet weirdly-dressed people lighting candles and throwing spells around.
I would have thought you'd need to be a druid
Due to a typo in the paperwork sent to HR by the hiring manager, they are only paying 64,189 pence. The director was last heard chastising HR, saying "It's not your job to be as confused as Nigel."
i know quite a few dev ops and frontend guys who were employed for last 4 years and are now driving taxi in india.
Better than Head of Easter Island.
"If I get the role, what will my budget for repairs be?"
really wish i keot my british passport
"Job type Permanent"
I bet they enjoyed typing that in.
"5,000 years+ -- depends on you"
Might be another option if it were freeform text
I caught a live stream of Stonehenge during this past Winter Solstice (it was cloudy, naturally) and the streamer provided a bit of trivia that I hadn't heard before:
George Washington's English ancestors, specifically Sir Lawrence Washington, were the owners of the West Amesbury Estate in Wiltshire, England, which included the land where the ancient Stonehenge monument sits. (Via Google)
If you hadn't that before, welcome to the "Huh, that's a funny coincidence" club.
Rich people have lots of descenders who tend to be rich.
Washington was a wealthy landowner in the British Empire, hardly surprising his ancestors were wealthy landowners.
What’s it a coincidence with?
"Rich man had a rich family, how queer"
Land owners also had married within family so I you checked their family tree two persons could be simultaneously spouses and cousins. That's a coincidence!
Honestly feels like a dream job. Imagine your ancestors smiling down on you if you are from Britain or just human.
Considering the location, I would imagine that the ancestors prefer to haunt the barrows at night. Still a dream job if that's your thing. Just watch out for the occasional Nazgûl. :)
On the front page? LLMs got lots of us programmers dreaming of leaving the profession, I suppose.
Is this not super cool regardless? Even if you love tech, was a fun little gem.
Missed opportunity to say they’re ‘looking for a rock star to lead our team!’
They pretty much are, too. It certainly reads like some tech job ads. Rock star with 30 years experience. Graduate wages.
The median income in the UK is currently sitting at £2,627 / week or £31,524 / year [1]. This is advertising more than double that at £64,189, not quite graduate wages!
[1] https://www.ons.gov.uk/employmentandlabourmarket/peopleinwor...
EDIT: £2,627 / month, not week!
2.67 * 52 = 138.84
Not sure how you got 31,524
They meant per month obviously.
Thanks, typo on my part.
Tasks include: looking at rocks, stars.
"a solid leader who can carry the weight of our massive responsibility"
They don't look for rock stars. English heritage wants ideology:
"You can connect with others through our EDI networks as a member or ally. These include Ethnic Diversity, Faith & Belief, Social Equity, LGBTQ+, Neurodivergence, Age, Disability and Gender Health and Wellbeing."
(Should have mentioned Talibans, handy to blow up misplaced stones)
Why is that ideology?
DEI, "woke ideology". It is not ideology in a strict sense.
Are you ok?
What do you mean?
Sounds like a very cool job, and not sure about the UK job market, but seems to be wildly underpaid for the qualifications!
Not disagreeing, but it's also worth something to know, and say, that you are in charge of Stonehenge.
Must be an extraordinary honor to be in charge of a bunch of rocks over there.
Wait until you learn some people are swapping bits all day long, isn't that crazy?
I call them Bit Shepherds
Yes?
This, shockingly, is actually quite well paid considering for the UK.
Lead Data Scientist for the UK Government is currently advertising for a salary of £57,670 - £67,500.
https://www.civilservicejobs.service.gov.uk/csr/jobs.cgi?jco...
Government jobs are terribly paid. They tend to have good pensions worth another 15-20k though and tend to be very flexible.
Project manager on 65-85k
https://uk.indeed.com/m/viewjob?jk=a43416327745431e
Lead data scientist 100-110k
https://www.reed.co.uk/jobs/lead-data-scientist/56925078
Neither of those are London based.
This is like a 90th percentile UK salary.
In reality, because the "salaries" higher than this aren't paying in PAYE.
36 hours per week. 25 days vacation (going to 28). Pension contributions. You can buy extra leave. Epic location, fun job, decent salary for the UK (where e.g. you don't pay for healthcare)...
You do pay for healthcare, from the taxes on that salary.
Fun fact, so do Americans, just they don't get the service for it!
Yeah, the 25 days of vacation are a bit disappointing, in Germany 30 days are standard.
Is that including or excluding bank holidays? In the UK, 25 days excluding the 8 bank holidays is pretty standard.
This is a decent salary for a heritage job. It is a very poorly-paid sector. On building sites with archaeological excavations, the person driving the digger is likely to be paid more than the archaeologists, who probably have postgraduate degrees.
Don't forget to deduct the 25% effective tax rate.
Calculator: https://www.tax.service.gov.uk/estimate-paye-take-home-pay/y...
I'm not in the UK, but from what I understand that's actually decent. US salaries, particularly in tech, are wildly higher than in most of Europe.
UK tech salaries are also not high. And 64k pounds for a history and/or business major is quite right. Do not forget also: history is a overrun study with many people afterwards driving taxis
this isnt all that *bad for something in the conservation / heritage / ngo sector
edit: *obviously its not a wonderful salary, but for the sector....well I've seen worse.
The charity sector rarely pays well.
Especially considering minimum wage “salary” in the UK is ~24k GBP, 64k is nothing imo. They call it the “wage squeeze”
The UK has had substantially less wage inequality than the US for a long time. The UK “wage squeeze” is median/minimum wage which has gone from the 1/3 to 2/3 since ~2000 as the minimum wage has been raised. But the relevant difference here would be around 90th percentile/median which is 1.85 in UK vs 2.4 in US and even higher in California.
And over time the ratio is similar - 90%ile about 1.9 times median for the last 30 years.
Average full time salary is 40k GBP. It’s +50% on the average which seems right for a non profit organisation in a non exec role
It is a leadership role though.
I don't know how many staff there are, but it's surely one of EH's most important locations.
This is like 90th percentile UK salary. It's good pay for the UK, a poor country.
The UK is still the 5th biggest economy in the world. Public infrastructure feels like it's under huge strain however, and there is also a big problem with inequality, which seems to be changing under Labour, albeit slowly.
Raw economy size can be misleading in two ways. The value of a dollar is much less or much more depending on where you're at. So an economy of 10 shekels might mean an economy of 100 widgets, or it might mean an economy of 1 widget. Purchasing power parity (PPP) attempts to account for that. The second is that economies are largely a product of population. An economy of a million making a million shekels is quite a bit different than an economy of 10 making a million shekels, so you also want to look at per capita values. Even both of these adjustments combined [1] can be extremely misleading (see: Ireland and many other places...), but they provide at least a less unreasonable basis for comparison than nominal dollars. And the UK is currently 30th there.
[1] - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)...
I think GDP per capita can also be misleading though - the GDP per capita of Luxembourg or Brunei is high, but they're such small countries that it's kind of irrelevant.
Setting aside the special cases (tiny, oil money, weird finance sectors, tax havens etc) there's basically a handful of countries which are clearly doing something right - the US, Taiwan, the north-eastern European countries (Germany, Austria, Netherlands, Belgium, Denmark, Sweden). Most of the other "developed countries" are sitting in the same sort of GDP per capita range of $65-$75k. Ranking these isn't so meaningful - the difference between the UK and France is only 1.5%.
Until it's destroyed by the people who destroyed the country last time.
Seems they are hell-bent on getting rid of them
Inquality has barely moved per Gini in the last thirty years, and GDP is very misleading.
https://ifs.org.uk/data-items/gini-coefficient
Let's not be delusional. The UK is not a poor country, and 64K is low by US tech standards but it's good by any other measure.
If the UK were a US state, its GDP per capita would rank it roughly on par with or just below Mississippi, making it the poorest state in the union.
While true from a per capita equivalency and too close for comfort, the median net worth of an adult in the UK is roughly $150,000, while in Mississippi it's $15,000. Also, its public services are provided, which substantially affects the quality of life.
The UK is poor and sprinting as fast as it can towards being poorer.
It's not a "good" wage in the US. It's exactly median.
Which is fine, someone has to be median, but really underwhelming for the (presumably highly-educated and talented) head of the #1 national historical monument.
It's £64K, not $64K (which is indeed about the median in the US). So, not bad.
Ah I misread that, but $86k is still not good for a highly educated professional.
Highly educated?
It's a leadership role, there's no education requirements on it.
It is good for a professional with specialization in history.
Superintendent of Mount Rushmore is paid $125–160k
Yeah, but 25 days holiday plus bank holidays means you're working like half the year at most. ;)
And don't you knock of at lunch on Fridays anyways? So that's like a 4 day work week, because let's face it, you're not really doing anything on the day you're knocking off early anyways. See you at the pub!
Read-Only-Fridays, and having a pub lunch so you're not doing much all afternoon anyway!
Just a smidge over $63k after tax and before gibbs.
The job market over here is shocking.
This is equivalent to $85,700 USD, not $63k.
Read it again. $63k after tax and before "gibbs" i.e. government-provided social distributions.
63k after tax in the us is about 86k before tax, so about the same.
Although in the us you have to pay for healthcare on top of that.
You pay for a private healthcare plan, and the US government pays tax money to the same healthcare companies to prop up the system.
Lol in Canada 64,000 pounds = $120K CAD which would put you in the 92nd income percentile.
What's your role?
I'm a CSO.
Oh nice, Strategy or Security?
Stonehenge.
"Just to be clear, you are saying you manage a hedge fund, right?"
"Yeah, a henge fund."
"Hedge fund."
"Henge fund."
"Hedge."
"Henge."
"...I think we're on the same page."
This had me giggling, thank you
Heard of it?
Stonehenge would be a great AI Lab name!