US support for Israel is one of the most horrible things imaginable, really makes me ashamed. It is only the US standing between the current horrendous status quo and Israel being an true international pariah state. Hopefully we cut off support and usher in a find out era.
(Though to be honest my position is probably that we need to go past cutting off support and US tax dollars should go toward reparations for Palesine, Lebanon and probably Iran and others, we are complicit in a lot of fucked shit.)
((I don't think those places are lead by great individuals and everything is amazing to be clear, I also think the people there have suffered immensely from a century of american, british and israeli meddling and we should be held accountable))
Because I don't think US tax money should go toward reparations for Palestine, Lebanon, Iran or anywhere else. We're not 'complicit' in the way you're framing it
The only reason Israel is able to commit the horrors they are is because they can fuck around without finding out due to US protection paid for by our tax dollars, we are absolutely complicit. Of course that's only in the immediate term, I urge you to look at the history of the region even a little critically, so much of the conflict there is rooted in British, American and Israeli meddling, it's an insane take to claim that we are not responsible and that we have not benefited immensely.
No, money has nothing to do with it. The US military aid package to Israel is only around 2-3% of Israel's annual state budget. That's a relatively small amount, and far less significant than people tend to make it out to be.
The US provides this aid because it serves American interests. A large portion of the money is actually spent in the US, benefiting the American defense industry, not just financially but also through technological development and shared innovation.
What Israel truly gains from the relationship with the US is diplomatic cover, mainly the UN Security Council veto. Israel is by far the most condemned country at the UN in terms of resolutions passed against it, whether that's justified or not is a separate debate.
I don't understand what the purpose of making a distinction between monetary support in terms of direct aid, and indirect aid. The entire apparatus of the US government is paid for by our taxes, we pay for it either way. We also pay for it in instability and negative sentiment.
> Israel is by far the most condemned country at the UN in terms of resolutions passed against it
It's crazy to me that you know this and yet it seems like you are still in support of the US protecting Israel? You still think this is a net win for the world? That's incomprehensible to me.
Read up on "Operation Clean Break" / "The Clean Break Doctrine". Israeli Jews came up with a plan to overthrow Iraq, Libya, Syria, Iran... Seven states in all that the Israeli Jews wanted to destroy so they could engage in genocide of the Palestinians without opposition, and steal the land of their neighboring states for their "Greater Israel Project" (Israel refuses to declare their borders as they plan to steal more land from their neighbors and the remaining surviving Palestinians).
The fun part was that their plan was that the US would do their fighting for them. And, it worked. US wars in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Iran. Millions dead in illegal wars of aggression, all to benefit genocidal messianic religious crazies who call themselves Israeli Jews / Zionists. Many trillions of the US debt is due to these wars for Israel. The US has gained nothing from any of these wars.
Professor Jeffrey Sacks is a good source for material about this.
To be honest the more I started getting interested in geopolitics the more I understood that the humanitarian ideals we preach simply don't work in real world.
Iran is dangerously close to acquiring nuclear weapons. Nobody wants that because Iran is a dictatorship and in case of an already ongoing conflict dictatorships have a bias towards escalation - see how Russia is still fighting in Ukraine even though it's obvious that the whole operation has been a huge mistake. Either we stop Iran or we get a second North Korea - go to South Korea and ask how they feel about a nuke being pointed at Seoul at all times.
Before Trump it was kind of taboo that US would just go to Iran and shoot them, hence the necessary existence of Israel that gives zero fucks and will shoot everyone who even thinks of threatening them. The deal was, US gives weapons to Israel, Israel shoots everyone that US doesn't like, Israel takes the moral blame but in exchange maintains its independence.
The point is, being morally right means nothing if you die, therefore even good guys need someone to do the dirty job once in a while in order to survive against an opponent that is not playing by the same rules. Imagine a world where police have no guns and politely ask criminals to stop.
And from the point of view of Israel - there is literally no good solution for the Palestine situation. If Palestine gets independence it's a matter of time before they declare war on Israel. Whether justified or not, the entire Arab world hates Israel just because they exist exactly where they do, and that's the reality Israelis live in.
You don't understand. The good guys are just giving preventive rocket medicine. The Palestinians and Iranians need it so they won't cause any atrocities. They should be grateful because if they got to live they could do something bad and then feel real bad about themselves.
I wonder if Iran being a dictatorship has a cause? Why does the Arab world hate Israel I wonder? Everything you're talking about is basically a direct result of UK, US and israeli bullshit in the area. It's people with exactly the same sort of colonial geopolitical ideas as you that CAUSED THE MESS IN THE FIRST PLACE.
They're almost certainly #1 global problem causers so it's usually the safest bet. Though I wouldn't be as expansive as you, the USA, Portugal, Spain and the USSR are no slouches. Can't be forgetting the Dutch either.
So basically all powerful countries cause problems for other countries. Not exactly a resolutionary thing. Don't forget China, Japan, Mongolia, Romans, all sorts of infighting between native American groups before Columbus. And I assume that Africa wasn't exactly a paradise even before colonialism.
Israeli Jews recently got out into the streets to protest for the right to rape, after some soldiers were prosecuted for a recorded rape of a Palestinian prisoner where a long knife blade was inserted into body orifices during the rape. The whisleblower was condemned while the rapists were celebrated.
I don't think the passive voice is meant to protect the perpetrators. Instead, they are presenting sexual assault as a deliberate tactic or policy, or at least a common pattern. If true, this is a much bigger story than isolated incidents of violence. But sixteen reported cases over three years seems very low. Likely there are more cases they missed. Mainly it seems like they have very little data.
The passive voice and dishonest language is often used by British and US corporate and state media when describing atrocities committed by Israeli Jews.
"Some Palestinians are dead. They seem to have just died. Nobody knows what happened." To describe massacres of Palestinians by Israeli Jews.
E.g., the BBC reported an IDF soldier, in uniform, who was captured as a prisoner of war as, "A young girl was kidnapped by Hammas." The BBC also reported on an 8 year old little girl who was kidnapped by the IDF and held as a hostage as, "a woman who was detained."
The UK (and Germany) are as bad as the US for media and government controlled by Zionists.
More likely, they already knew what they wanted to say, data or no data: Israel/US, bad: global revolution, good. They have to keep the pressure up so they need to write papers and get articles written about those papers and then get them posted on hacker news regardless of what actually happened. It’s a constant grind, but I suppose it will all be worth it for them if they get appointed on the committee of the vanguard or something like that.
Look up the article in Ha'aretz recently "IDF Soldiers Talk About the 'Moral Injury' – and the Silence" for another example of this. I mean, I am glad they are talking about it, but the way it is framed is maddening.
Sexual assault and violence is the biblical explanation for the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah according to more and more modern biblical scholars. The Christian's who hate the gays should instead direct their bible and politicians at Israeli soldiers and their government.
I live in a country that while deeply perverted, is still not very sexually liberated day to day. And I also have many people in my social group that for reasons of cultural exchange have visited and lived in Israel. For someone who grew up in a country where it was normal to be writing essasy in high-school history class about the Balfour declaration, I'm was always amazed about how unaware they all seemed to be about the issues there. One thing I often hear from them is about more sex they were having or seeing around them In Israel. Or how it was much more directly part of the social life. And how much more things like other peoples play was visible in sex clubs or.. there was more "taboo" things taking place. I wonder what is going on in Israeli society that this kind of liberation exists side by side with these continuous reports of sexual violence in prisons, and now this.. What is the vibe line in a swingers club or on tinder if you're having to side eye someone wondering if they've be involved in that.. I have seen talk about rainbow washing, and homonationalism.. And its not like .. Israel is exactly publicly marketing itself as a bastion of sexual freedom .. but it seems to be part of people private conversations.. what do we call this.. eronationalism?
The christian supporters of Israel can also think a bit about the itf soldiers destroying a statue of Jesus in Lebanon if they want to understand what they are supporting. Useful idiots doesn't even start to describe it.
It's ironic that netanyahu says that Christians are thriving in Israel and more than any other middle Eastern country.
Only 2% of Israel identifies as Christian, whereas Lebanon has 37%, which Israel is bombing
US support for Israel is one of the most horrible things imaginable, really makes me ashamed. It is only the US standing between the current horrendous status quo and Israel being an true international pariah state. Hopefully we cut off support and usher in a find out era.
(Though to be honest my position is probably that we need to go past cutting off support and US tax dollars should go toward reparations for Palesine, Lebanon and probably Iran and others, we are complicit in a lot of fucked shit.)
((I don't think those places are lead by great individuals and everything is amazing to be clear, I also think the people there have suffered immensely from a century of american, british and israeli meddling and we should be held accountable))
"Opinions" like yours just show that the US is in a process of self destruction
Why?
Because I don't think US tax money should go toward reparations for Palestine, Lebanon, Iran or anywhere else. We're not 'complicit' in the way you're framing it
The only reason Israel is able to commit the horrors they are is because they can fuck around without finding out due to US protection paid for by our tax dollars, we are absolutely complicit. Of course that's only in the immediate term, I urge you to look at the history of the region even a little critically, so much of the conflict there is rooted in British, American and Israeli meddling, it's an insane take to claim that we are not responsible and that we have not benefited immensely.
No, money has nothing to do with it. The US military aid package to Israel is only around 2-3% of Israel's annual state budget. That's a relatively small amount, and far less significant than people tend to make it out to be.
The US provides this aid because it serves American interests. A large portion of the money is actually spent in the US, benefiting the American defense industry, not just financially but also through technological development and shared innovation.
What Israel truly gains from the relationship with the US is diplomatic cover, mainly the UN Security Council veto. Israel is by far the most condemned country at the UN in terms of resolutions passed against it, whether that's justified or not is a separate debate.
I don't understand what the purpose of making a distinction between monetary support in terms of direct aid, and indirect aid. The entire apparatus of the US government is paid for by our taxes, we pay for it either way. We also pay for it in instability and negative sentiment.
> Israel is by far the most condemned country at the UN in terms of resolutions passed against it
It's crazy to me that you know this and yet it seems like you are still in support of the US protecting Israel? You still think this is a net win for the world? That's incomprehensible to me.
Read up on "Operation Clean Break" / "The Clean Break Doctrine". Israeli Jews came up with a plan to overthrow Iraq, Libya, Syria, Iran... Seven states in all that the Israeli Jews wanted to destroy so they could engage in genocide of the Palestinians without opposition, and steal the land of their neighboring states for their "Greater Israel Project" (Israel refuses to declare their borders as they plan to steal more land from their neighbors and the remaining surviving Palestinians).
The fun part was that their plan was that the US would do their fighting for them. And, it worked. US wars in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Iran. Millions dead in illegal wars of aggression, all to benefit genocidal messianic religious crazies who call themselves Israeli Jews / Zionists. Many trillions of the US debt is due to these wars for Israel. The US has gained nothing from any of these wars.
Professor Jeffrey Sacks is a good source for material about this.
To be honest the more I started getting interested in geopolitics the more I understood that the humanitarian ideals we preach simply don't work in real world.
Iran is dangerously close to acquiring nuclear weapons. Nobody wants that because Iran is a dictatorship and in case of an already ongoing conflict dictatorships have a bias towards escalation - see how Russia is still fighting in Ukraine even though it's obvious that the whole operation has been a huge mistake. Either we stop Iran or we get a second North Korea - go to South Korea and ask how they feel about a nuke being pointed at Seoul at all times.
Before Trump it was kind of taboo that US would just go to Iran and shoot them, hence the necessary existence of Israel that gives zero fucks and will shoot everyone who even thinks of threatening them. The deal was, US gives weapons to Israel, Israel shoots everyone that US doesn't like, Israel takes the moral blame but in exchange maintains its independence.
The point is, being morally right means nothing if you die, therefore even good guys need someone to do the dirty job once in a while in order to survive against an opponent that is not playing by the same rules. Imagine a world where police have no guns and politely ask criminals to stop.
And from the point of view of Israel - there is literally no good solution for the Palestine situation. If Palestine gets independence it's a matter of time before they declare war on Israel. Whether justified or not, the entire Arab world hates Israel just because they exist exactly where they do, and that's the reality Israelis live in.
> even good guys
I assume in your fantasy said "good guys" are the US?
https://www.hrw.org/news/2022/01/09/20-years-us-torture-and-...
https://www.numberanalytics.com/blog/ultimate-guide-to-us-wa...
https://theconversation.com/operation-condor-the-secret-syst...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Hemisphere_Institute_f...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_war_crimes
Ok now show me a nation that never in its history has committed any atrocities.
Why? I'm not the one separating nations between "good guys" and "bad guys".
You don't understand. The good guys are just giving preventive rocket medicine. The Palestinians and Iranians need it so they won't cause any atrocities. They should be grateful because if they got to live they could do something bad and then feel real bad about themselves.
I wonder if Iran being a dictatorship has a cause? Why does the Arab world hate Israel I wonder? Everything you're talking about is basically a direct result of UK, US and israeli bullshit in the area. It's people with exactly the same sort of colonial geopolitical ideas as you that CAUSED THE MESS IN THE FIRST PLACE.
When in doubt, blame the British. The British theorem: all life's problems can eventually be traced back to the British.
They're almost certainly #1 global problem causers so it's usually the safest bet. Though I wouldn't be as expansive as you, the USA, Portugal, Spain and the USSR are no slouches. Can't be forgetting the Dutch either.
So basically all powerful countries cause problems for other countries. Not exactly a resolutionary thing. Don't forget China, Japan, Mongolia, Romans, all sorts of infighting between native American groups before Columbus. And I assume that Africa wasn't exactly a paradise even before colonialism.
The largest empire in global history had influence on contemporary geopolitics. Why should we pretend otherwise?
The language in the article would be fascinating if it wasn't such a horrible thing.
It's not that the Israeli soldiers are sexually assaulting Palestinians, instead they are using Sexual Assault.
Later they say "Sexualised violence is used...", "men and boys were Targeted..."
It's like there is a gun shooting people, or someone using a gun. But we can't connect fully understand how or who is perpetuating it.
Edit: some more:
"Israeli soldiers present during abuse had repeatedly failed to prevent it..." Who was abusing?
> Who was abusing?
Israeli Jews. Both IDF soldiers and civilians.
Rape was always a weapon by the Israeli Jews. Remember that every accusation made by the Israeli Jews is an admission.
https://www.un.org/unispal/document/report-of-the-commission...
Israeli Jews recently got out into the streets to protest for the right to rape, after some soldiers were prosecuted for a recorded rape of a Palestinian prisoner where a long knife blade was inserted into body orifices during the rape. The whisleblower was condemned while the rapists were celebrated.
https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/israelis-rio...
I don't think the passive voice is meant to protect the perpetrators. Instead, they are presenting sexual assault as a deliberate tactic or policy, or at least a common pattern. If true, this is a much bigger story than isolated incidents of violence. But sixteen reported cases over three years seems very low. Likely there are more cases they missed. Mainly it seems like they have very little data.
The passive voice and dishonest language is often used by British and US corporate and state media when describing atrocities committed by Israeli Jews.
"Some Palestinians are dead. They seem to have just died. Nobody knows what happened." To describe massacres of Palestinians by Israeli Jews.
E.g., the BBC reported an IDF soldier, in uniform, who was captured as a prisoner of war as, "A young girl was kidnapped by Hammas." The BBC also reported on an 8 year old little girl who was kidnapped by the IDF and held as a hostage as, "a woman who was detained."
The UK (and Germany) are as bad as the US for media and government controlled by Zionists.
More likely, they already knew what they wanted to say, data or no data: Israel/US, bad: global revolution, good. They have to keep the pressure up so they need to write papers and get articles written about those papers and then get them posted on hacker news regardless of what actually happened. It’s a constant grind, but I suppose it will all be worth it for them if they get appointed on the committee of the vanguard or something like that.
Look up the article in Ha'aretz recently "IDF Soldiers Talk About the 'Moral Injury' – and the Silence" for another example of this. I mean, I am glad they are talking about it, but the way it is framed is maddening.
The settlers. They are there illegally and do illegal things but the soldiers are there to provide them with functional immunity
The article starts with “Israeli soldiers and settlers” so presumably the answer to your question is settlers.
> Who was abusing?
It's possible that in some cases it was settlers. So technically not soldiers. But soldiers protected them, incl. from any resisting abuse.
Nothing to say. Just absolutely maddening that this is what my taxes go to accomplish
Sexual assault and violence is the biblical explanation for the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah according to more and more modern biblical scholars. The Christian's who hate the gays should instead direct their bible and politicians at Israeli soldiers and their government.
I live in a country that while deeply perverted, is still not very sexually liberated day to day. And I also have many people in my social group that for reasons of cultural exchange have visited and lived in Israel. For someone who grew up in a country where it was normal to be writing essasy in high-school history class about the Balfour declaration, I'm was always amazed about how unaware they all seemed to be about the issues there. One thing I often hear from them is about more sex they were having or seeing around them In Israel. Or how it was much more directly part of the social life. And how much more things like other peoples play was visible in sex clubs or.. there was more "taboo" things taking place. I wonder what is going on in Israeli society that this kind of liberation exists side by side with these continuous reports of sexual violence in prisons, and now this.. What is the vibe line in a swingers club or on tinder if you're having to side eye someone wondering if they've be involved in that.. I have seen talk about rainbow washing, and homonationalism.. And its not like .. Israel is exactly publicly marketing itself as a bastion of sexual freedom .. but it seems to be part of people private conversations.. what do we call this.. eronationalism?
If only hell was real.
Well it sure must seem real for Palestinians. And it's just called life on Earth.
The christian supporters of Israel can also think a bit about the itf soldiers destroying a statue of Jesus in Lebanon if they want to understand what they are supporting. Useful idiots doesn't even start to describe it.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cpd575n1znzo
Maybe they were carrying out exodus 20:4...
It's ironic that netanyahu says that Christians are thriving in Israel and more than any other middle Eastern country. Only 2% of Israel identifies as Christian, whereas Lebanon has 37%, which Israel is bombing
Anything for Second Coming of Jesus