Maybe I can finally debug that cool-looking boxing game I typed in by hand from a magazine. To this day, I am sort of surprised I wound up a coder given that was my initial experience with programming.
Figuring out where I messed up (or where they misprinted) in the hundreds of lines of code entered from some of these listings was my introduction to debugging :D
I didn't really know about this until recently when I listened to a DHH / Lex Fridman podcast. The podcast started out with him retelling a very similar experience. I wasn't familiar with DHH either and found myself disagreeing with a lot of his takes (JS > TS ... really?) but it was a really interesting conversation none-the-less.
While this is true (and the price for the new device is still extremely reasonable) by 1983 you could buy a C64 for $199 (in the US anyway).
This price reduction was the difference maker in allowing my family to (barely) afford to buy me a C64 in late 1983 (and this is what I learned to code on, first in MS BASIC, then in 6510 assembler).
In East Germany, the GDR, you could buy C64 and C128 from private sellers advertising in the classified ads section of the major electronics magazine in the GDR. They usually received those devices from relatives in West Germany.
The price for a C64 was thousands of East German Marks, at least half a year of salaries (the salary spread was low, so that's engineers or workers or managers).
An Amiga cost 25,000 Marks towards the end of the GDR, which was about two years of salaries (income was from below 1,000 Marks to ca. 1,500 for high earners, much more than that was unusual). This put 16 bit computing at home or school out of the hands of almost everyone, unless they had generous relatives in the West who sent them one. Even at work, the 8-bit PCs were still much more common (e.g. PC 1715 - https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/PC_1715), with a CP/M clone OS.
But at least they were all available. Our own CAOS (Cassette Aided Operating System- https://www.mpm-kc85.de/html/CAOS_42.htm) 8 bit systems based on Z80 clone CPUs, KC-85 (1/2/3/4) where not too shabby, for work and serious stuff at least the later -3 and even more so the -4 lines were superior to the C64, easier to program, and much more usable screen (https://www.mpm-kc85.de/).
The state was pretty hands-off. My own school's physics teacher started a computer club in the 1980s and he spent thousands of public school money on exclusively Western computers, from ZX spectrum (the very first one) to Atari 800 XL, C64, C128, with both cassette and disk drives. That must have cost a lot. Still surprises me that nobody asked him to buy East German, especially since in the 8-bit range our own systems would have been perfectly fine for the purpose.
"Your childhood just leveled up" as a tagline is pretty revealing. I'm not sure where the company goes after they have mined all the nostalgia. I like the statement "[t]his isn’t tech that controls you. It invites you to play, learn, and create" but I'm struggling to think of how that converts into a long-term product line. I wish them success though. More diversity would be nice!
Why do they need to? Can't that just be it? Why does everything need to grow forever? We all die. That doesn't mean it was necessarily a bad idea to live.
I miss the days of BBS'ing on my 300 baud modem, boosted to 420-ish. Things were so much simpler. I'm thinking this might make a good xmas present for myself! :)
> I miss the days of BBS'ing on my 300 baud modem, boosted to 420-ish. Things were so much simpler.
I have a lot of nostalgia from this time, but also remember it was all fun and games until my mom or one of my sisters picked up one of the phones (standard issue AT&T handsets) in the house, causing a rapid burst of line noise and usually a disconnection due to lack of error checking/correction at the hardware level.
If you had some idea of who was on the BBS and they had Call Waiting, you could give them a ring to knock them offline. Very bad manners but teens will be teens.
I was there in the 300 bps days with a Novation Apple Cat II and I never heard of such a thing. How did that work? Did you have non-standard modems on both ends?
I built my own 300bps modem as a teenager, to connect to my C64. Tech was a lot more fun back in the day. It was exciting every year to see the speed of modems go up, and up, and up. 300 bps, 1200bps, and then when I got a 2400bps modem the C64 built-in serial code was too slow, I couldn't transfer files because there were so many dropped bits. So I wrote my own serial port code in assembly language and hacked it into my favorite terminal software (CCGMS) and that fixed the problem. I think by the time I got a 9600 baud modem I probably had an Amiga.
Ordered a founder's edition in August. Looks like I might get it this year (originally estimated October). Retro Recipes x Commodore posted a video update about the manufacturing process recently: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BffeaLbKHkw
(In my case, it's not about nostalgia. I actually have been using a shared one in a hackerspace to play around with 6502 machine language and want my own.)
I'm excited for Christian (Peri) and team... but also kinda bummed that the RR channel has gone on a bit of a hiatus (understandable). Wishing everyone success with this amazing new chapter...
I might get one, I have the C64 Max and the kids are having a lot of fun on it with their friends playing Bruce Lee 1 and 2 as well as Archon. I'm also really really interested in http://www.apollo-core.com/gfx/A6000.jpg the amiga was my first programming machine and having a mostly useful computer that is compatible would be awesome.
I thought all these were all simulations and not replicas of silicon. I'm talking about something that keeps all the interference flaws and weirdness of the analog synth intact, and every chip being just a little bit unique, like the original.
Aren't they the standard Atari-style, with the RS-232 style ports? It should be cheap to get ahold of some compatible joysticks. I would hope they kept all the ports the same...
Not sure why, they have header pins for the user port and then an adapter if you want to use things that require the original edge connector. I'm guessing (although I'm not sure what those other chips on the adapter do) you could also connect directly to the header for new stuff. https://www.commodore.net/product-page/u64-userport-adapter
Maybe I can finally debug that cool-looking boxing game I typed in by hand from a magazine. To this day, I am sort of surprised I wound up a coder given that was my initial experience with programming.
Pages and pages of numbers to type in...
> I typed in by hand from a magazine.
Probably Compute!'s Gazette.
Figuring out where I messed up (or where they misprinted) in the hundreds of lines of code entered from some of these listings was my introduction to debugging :D
I loved Compute!'s Gazette.
I miss good print magazines
It’s back!
https://www.computesgazette.com/
I didn't really know about this until recently when I listened to a DHH / Lex Fridman podcast. The podcast started out with him retelling a very similar experience. I wasn't familiar with DHH either and found myself disagreeing with a lot of his takes (JS > TS ... really?) but it was a really interesting conversation none-the-less.
It’s the same as the Ultimate 64 Elite II from Gideon, which is great. It got me back into C64 coding https://github.com/sandlbn/whisper64 , now in C.
$299 is about half the price, not corrected for inflation, of the original, which started at $595 (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodore_64).
I think that’s impressive, given the (likely) way lower production run.
Why wouldn't you correct it for inflation?
It will be 2000 2025 dollars at launch time.
So it is pretty cheap compared.
The mentioned 1983 price, is 643 of 2025 dollars
While this is true (and the price for the new device is still extremely reasonable) by 1983 you could buy a C64 for $199 (in the US anyway).
This price reduction was the difference maker in allowing my family to (barely) afford to buy me a C64 in late 1983 (and this is what I learned to code on, first in MS BASIC, then in 6510 assembler).
In East Germany, the GDR, you could buy C64 and C128 from private sellers advertising in the classified ads section of the major electronics magazine in the GDR. They usually received those devices from relatives in West Germany.
The price for a C64 was thousands of East German Marks, at least half a year of salaries (the salary spread was low, so that's engineers or workers or managers).
An Amiga cost 25,000 Marks towards the end of the GDR, which was about two years of salaries (income was from below 1,000 Marks to ca. 1,500 for high earners, much more than that was unusual). This put 16 bit computing at home or school out of the hands of almost everyone, unless they had generous relatives in the West who sent them one. Even at work, the 8-bit PCs were still much more common (e.g. PC 1715 - https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/PC_1715), with a CP/M clone OS.
But at least they were all available. Our own CAOS (Cassette Aided Operating System- https://www.mpm-kc85.de/html/CAOS_42.htm) 8 bit systems based on Z80 clone CPUs, KC-85 (1/2/3/4) where not too shabby, for work and serious stuff at least the later -3 and even more so the -4 lines were superior to the C64, easier to program, and much more usable screen (https://www.mpm-kc85.de/).
The state was pretty hands-off. My own school's physics teacher started a computer club in the 1980s and he spent thousands of public school money on exclusively Western computers, from ZX spectrum (the very first one) to Atari 800 XL, C64, C128, with both cassette and disk drives. That must have cost a lot. Still surprises me that nobody asked him to buy East German, especially since in the 8-bit range our own systems would have been perfectly fine for the purpose.
Wasn't the GDR subject to CoCom restrictions?
"Your childhood just leveled up" as a tagline is pretty revealing. I'm not sure where the company goes after they have mined all the nostalgia. I like the statement "[t]his isn’t tech that controls you. It invites you to play, learn, and create" but I'm struggling to think of how that converts into a long-term product line. I wish them success though. More diversity would be nice!
Why do they need to? Can't that just be it? Why does everything need to grow forever? We all die. That doesn't mean it was necessarily a bad idea to live.
They don't need to, but it does seem to be the plan: "every penny goes into manufacturing first, and then to the mission to reboot Commodore itself"
Oh I didn't notice. Interesting, maybe they will do something new. We need more friendly computing.
I miss the days of BBS'ing on my 300 baud modem, boosted to 420-ish. Things were so much simpler. I'm thinking this might make a good xmas present for myself! :)
> I miss the days of BBS'ing on my 300 baud modem, boosted to 420-ish. Things were so much simpler.
I have a lot of nostalgia from this time, but also remember it was all fun and games until my mom or one of my sisters picked up one of the phones (standard issue AT&T handsets) in the house, causing a rapid burst of line noise and usually a disconnection due to lack of error checking/correction at the hardware level.
And if that happened, you might not get back on. The line might be busy, you might have run out of time or logins for the day..
If you had some idea of who was on the BBS and they had Call Waiting, you could give them a ring to knock them offline. Very bad manners but teens will be teens.
> boosted to 420-ish
I was there in the 300 bps days with a Novation Apple Cat II and I never heard of such a thing. How did that work? Did you have non-standard modems on both ends?
100% with you. I miss those times.. High-5 to a fellow 300bauder!
I built my own 300bps modem as a teenager, to connect to my C64. Tech was a lot more fun back in the day. It was exciting every year to see the speed of modems go up, and up, and up. 300 bps, 1200bps, and then when I got a 2400bps modem the C64 built-in serial code was too slow, I couldn't transfer files because there were so many dropped bits. So I wrote my own serial port code in assembly language and hacked it into my favorite terminal software (CCGMS) and that fixed the problem. I think by the time I got a 9600 baud modem I probably had an Amiga.
I am making music with original C64s. I am excited about this one to get maybe a more noise free experience. Let's see. I've ordered in July.
Ordered a founder's edition in August. Looks like I might get it this year (originally estimated October). Retro Recipes x Commodore posted a video update about the manufacturing process recently: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BffeaLbKHkw
(In my case, it's not about nostalgia. I actually have been using a shared one in a hackerspace to play around with 6502 machine language and want my own.)
I hope the keyboard is a USB keyboard so I can use it as input for my linux box :)
I have the 8BitDo C64 retro keyboard. It even is wireless, but also has USB. It is a charm.
I'm excited for Christian (Peri) and team... but also kinda bummed that the RR channel has gone on a bit of a hiatus (understandable). Wishing everyone success with this amazing new chapter...
I might get one, I have the C64 Max and the kids are having a lot of fun on it with their friends playing Bruce Lee 1 and 2 as well as Archon. I'm also really really interested in http://www.apollo-core.com/gfx/A6000.jpg the amiga was my first programming machine and having a mostly useful computer that is compatible would be awesome.
Is it feasible to fabricate new MOS 6581 chips?
Pretty sure there are a bunch of different types of clones on eBay.
I thought all these were all simulations and not replicas of silicon. I'm talking about something that keeps all the interference flaws and weirdness of the analog synth intact, and every chip being just a little bit unique, like the original.
Mmmmm tricky, even replicas aren't usually done in the same exact process.
Does not come with joy controllers and they are $40/ea.
Aren't they the standard Atari-style, with the RS-232 style ports? It should be cheap to get ahold of some compatible joysticks. I would hope they kept all the ports the same...
Is this using Jeri Ellsworth's implementation of Commodore 64 in FPGA?
No, it's based on the AMD Xilinx Artix-7 FPGA.
Jeri Ellsworth's was actually an ASIC.
She made a "C-One" which was FPGA based, but this one is different, the C64Ultimate uses Gideon Zweijtzer's design in the AMD Xilinx.
Ah - but Jeri is still in the team. That makes me happy: https://www.commodore.net/team/
Having Amiga legend Dave Haynie on the team also helps inspire confidence.
that's quite the team. Ellsworth, Charpentier, Herd, Tramiel, etc. (i didn't recognize all the other names)
LOL, Leonard Tramiel - Chief Tramiel Officer
I was scrolling through that list and did at a double take at... Thomas Middleditch? The actor from Silicon Valley?
Oh, no, his start up running skills left much to be desired.
I suppose hijinks will inevitably ensue!
"The motherboard is a heavily modified version of Gideon Zweijtzer's original design." [0]
[0] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BffeaLbKHkw&t=206s
They kept the cassette port, but got rid of the User port? The User port is where all the good stuff goes.
They could have put the Ethernet and other new stuff on the left side where there's plenty of room.
Was it the user port or cartridge port where we'd ground the reset line with a paperclip to reset the C64? I can't remember.
They both have one: https://archive.org/details/commodore-64-manual-en-1982/page...
On the user port I managed to short 5V to GND instead :'(
Not sure why, they have header pins for the user port and then an adapter if you want to use things that require the original edge connector. I'm guessing (although I'm not sure what those other chips on the adapter do) you could also connect directly to the header for new stuff. https://www.commodore.net/product-page/u64-userport-adapter