They did a reprint of the original magazine from January 1984, to mark its 40 year anniversary. It can still be purchased online at https://prodavnica.pcpress.rs/issue/339/1, and they ship internationally.
I got my copy a few months ago, wanting to own a small piece of history.
You can buy the actual computer kit as well at https://pcpress.rs/galaksija/, but that one ships only within Serbia.
> "You can buy the actual computer kit as well at https://pcpress.rs/galaksija/, but that one ships only within Serbia."
Even though the website only allows domestic shipping, I suspect (without knowing anything about that country or their culture) that the sort of company which sells a product like that would be pleased enough by the idea that a foreigner wants to buy it that if you contact them there's a good chance they'd be willing to send it internationally if you paid the shipping cost.
The listed price is 8,000 RSD (Serbian Dinars) is equal to ~£57 / ~$74 - so even if the shipping was as expensive as the item itself, it still wouldn't be insanely expensive for someone who really wants it.
There is a good talk about this computer here https://youtu.be/K2chYqir53U, in the vein of similar talks about the commodore 64 and gameboy, that goes very in depth on the inner workings of the galaksija
No, they used a semi-custom chip known as an uncommitted logic array (ULA). It was basically a bunch of building blocks on a die that were designed once for a variety of possible applications, and then reconfigured by the factory to customer's spec. The idea was that most of the design work only needed to be done once, so cranking out customer-specific ASICs was cheaper than a 100% custom design.
Now we have FPGAs, so this approach is pretty much obsolete.
Off topic question: I'm wondering why you shared this link when the article is on a website that doesn't have a paywall and is big enough that it's not at risk of HN traffic being an effective ddos the way smaller websites can be affected. Just being helpful in case someone in the future finds this thread and the original link is dead?
> How one engineer beat the ban on home computers in socialist Yugoslavia
The title simply isn't true. There was no ban on home computers, just a value limit for an import. And as the article shows, homegrown computers were common.
It was not a ban on home computers, so wording is not the best one, but limiting value for an import is effectively a ban. Especially since there was a significant inflation at that time in Yugoslavia. Import limits were defined in dinars, and if it was enough for let's say Commodore 64 with disk drive, monitor and printer when new limit was introduced, the next year it was barely enough for Spectrum, and afterwards not even for that. If I remember correctly (and maybe I don't), Galaksija computer was planned around this limitation - CPU and other components had to be imported but they were below the import limit.
So, in those periods when inflation made importing impossible, there were two main sources of "west" home computers - smuggling, and Yugoslav citizens who went abroad to work for few years were not subject to import limits when returning home with their personal belongings.
General idea behind these limits was to strengthen domestic industry, and your list shows that - plethora of home computers made in Yugoslavia. Unfortunately, these computers were not compatible with anything and with no software they were educational tools at best. That's why no one was buying them except schools and other organizations who had no other choice. It changed a bit with Lira as it was PC compatible, but it came a bit later when Yugoslavia started opening up and these import limits were slowly lifted.
The point here is that in the former Yugoslavia, there was essentially a ban on almost everything, pushing a significant part of the economy into the grey or black market. These bans often felt like the odd attempts of a dysfunctional and decaying system to maintain control. For instance, it was technically illegal to buy foreign currency, yet all valuable assets—like land and houses—were still priced in Deutsche Marks (DMs).
Adding to the irony, nearly a million Yugoslavs worked in Germany as “Gastarbeiter” (guest workers). They acted as unofficial import channels, bringing foreign goods and currency back home.
Interestingly, despite the “restrictions”, there was a vibrant tech scene. Commodore and ZX Spectrum computers were surprisingly common. If I remember correctly, Galaksija actually looked like attempt by government to maintain control - I could be wrong (war might change perspective).
Galaksija was purely enthusiasm of one man (Voja Antonić), with support from Dejan Ristanović and crew gathered around Računari u vašoj kući magazine, who published Galaksija bluprints and instructions, and provided logistic help with boards and parts. It was not in any form government project. If anything, it was intended to fly under the radar. At that time in Yugoslavia, enthusiastic people doing progressive things were more concerned about how to make something work without the government noticing and meddling too much. There were several factory made home computers afterwards in Yugoslavia, and for them we can discuss whether they were encouraged by the government to keep things under control and locally produced, but it should not apply to Galaksija.
It's true from what I can see. They specifically banned the general public from importing any goods worth more than 50 Deutsche Marks (all computers). I'm sure those with connections could get around that and not wind up locked up though but after googling prisons in Yugoslavia I can see why DIY computing became popular.
On one hand, the import value limit effectively did ban home computers, which is why these "homegrown" computers became common as a way around the ban. On the other hand, "a ban on home computers" sounds like an intentional ban on home computing, which is a distortion of both the letter and spirit of the law.
Surprising, was there no opposition to russian occupation in Serbia? In Poland there was a strict ban on personal ownership of typewriters, fax machines, copiers, printers, radio transmitters, modems and computers (3 year prison term minimum). CIA was smuggling those to Poland with the help of Church https://www.nytimes.com/1992/02/18/world/reagan-and-pope-rep...
>The report in Time adds many new details, particularly the role of the Central Intelligence Agency and the Roman Catholic Church in opening networks across which telephones, fax machines, printing presses, photocopiers, computers and intelligence information moved to Solidarity.
Personal possession anecdote from book "High-tech behind the Iron Curtain. Electronics, computers and control systems in the Polish People's Republic" ("High-tech za żelazną kurtyną. Elektronika, komputery i systemy sterowania w PRL" 978-83-8098-094-5)
>In 1984, "Informatyka" magazine, involved in the dissemination of these machines, reported on the adventures of Mr. Przemysław, who received in April [...] a package from his brother in Toronto, containing the VIC-20 microcomputer, power supply, cassette recorder, a set of cassettes for television games and English language manual and connecting cables. The Customs Office in Gdynia refused to issue an import license, stating that it could issue [...] only if the computer was necessary for the citizen's professional or scientific work
It slowly got better in second half of the 80s. COCOM relaxed import sanctions in 1984 on low end 8bit gaming machines:
>The breakthrough in the domestication of computers in Poland took place
in the mid-1980s, most likely between 1984 and 1986. In the global context, this
might have been relatively late, but in the context of the Eastern bloc it seems that
Poland was within the norm. There are two main reasons behind this chronology: one international, one local. Firstly, on an international level, the embargo on 8-bit technology was relaxed in 1984. Computers had been at the heart of the
CoCom debate since the mid-1970s, but – as Mastanduno reports – it was not
until July 1984 that the embargo on the most popular 8-bit microcomputers was
removed, even though at the same time new restrictions were introduced regarding various telecommunications software and solutions.
In 1985 you could finally legally buy 8bit Atari in Pewex - chain of special shops established to siphon western currency out of the black market.
>Secondly, on a local level, as Kluska reports, in the autumn of 1984, the “[Polish] customs office
ceased to make it difficult for citizens to import microcomputer equipment.”
I was totally ignorant on the subject of Yugoslawia, and oh wow it managed to come out of Yalta as somewhat independent dictatorship and avoided establishment of USSR military bases on its territory by staying outside of Warsaw Pact.
The whole Eastern Bloc was quite multifaceted. And in its final years, so beautiful. (Those same places are still beautiful now of course, but in different ways).
I presume downvotes are coming because it turns out that the person I responded to was overstating their case somewhat. I was quick to presume the Guardian was being sloppy again, and that seems to have not been the case here. Fair enough.
The ban wasn't a ban on home computers but rather a ban on foreign imports.
One could argue that it spawned the creativity of domestic creatives who built the home computer anyway with the available resources.
I'm not personally favouring protectionism of this sort but we have to be fair to the thing we're criticizing and there is plenty to say about the Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia without having to resort to claims that they wanted to ban home computers for the sake of it
It'll be interesting to see if protectionism works better for America than Yugoslavia. Domestically, America has a strong free market economy, and it has healthy trading relationships with most other nations. What Trump proposes with China is mostly a geo-political play, and will be done in targeted fashion to restore America's industrial production capacity.
It’s pretty common in American political discourse. If you look at the discussion around the Affordable Care Act there were tons of predictions that it was the next step on the road to a communist takeover including quoting Lenin and even comparisons to slavery:
https://www.baltimoresun.com/2013/10/09/ben-carson-breaks-ne...
Many people know that’s nonsense but there is never a shortage of people willing to lie for political advantage and in that case there was so much money at stake that you could make a political career criticizing the evils of socialized medicine.
My elderly nan had a fall this morning and has badly hurt her back. She has been lying on the floor in her house since this morning (six hours so far), immobile, waiting for an ambulance to arrive. I wish I lived near her so I could help. She needs an ambulance unfortunately as she literally cannot move - she is in terrible pain.
When/if the ambulance finally does arrive, it will take her to a crowded, failing hospital where she will probably have to wait several more hours before being seen by an underpaid and overstretched nurse in a miserable ward.
Our system is failing, and not because it is underfunded (it gets nearly £200 billion a year and it has had real-terms increases in funding for decades, and employs 2M people). It is failing because:
* it is monolithic and unwieldy
* it has no efficiency incentives
* it is a state monopoly, so it is able to underpay and poorly treat its staff
* politicians are not the right people to preside over healthcare
* it is considered our national religion, and it doesn't get the scrutiny it deserves
The European public/private model provides much better quality and outcomes. The American system, expensive though it is, provides far better quality and outcomes.
I'm a republican who is also opposed to public healthcare and I understand it isn't communism. Most of the other republicans with whom I interact also understand that. Not all republicans engage in false equivalence.
> To be fair, I’ve never seen socialized healthcare conflated with communism.
> I'm a republican who is also opposed to public healthcare and I understand it isn't communism
You know that guy who leads your party? Large, orange, shouty? He's conflated it with communism, repeatedly. You should perhaps consider paying more attention.
I think for myself and do not just adopt whatever view happens to be espoused by a party leader. I'm sure he may have conflated socialized healthcare with communism at some point, but my original point remains that most of the republicans I know do not believe such things.
The point also remains that I haven't seen socialized healthcare conflated with communism. While it wouldn't surprise me if Trump said it, I have not personally seen it.
I mean, Trump has accused Harris of having a "far-left agenda" and of being a "Marxist", when at best she would be center, center-left to an European eye.
That's not really "far-left" or "Marxist", at least in my book. But then again, I'm not American. At some point, I believe Trump also proposed some pretty aggressive protectionist policies concerning foreign imports.
Trump did indeed propose some protectionist policies concerning foreign imports. It was oddly left leaning. Makes me wonder if the parties are switching platforms again.
> ...when at best she would be center, center-left to an European eye.
You must understand something about her platform and policies, I sure don't. She hasn't said much of substance. All the bitching between the two of them is like watching my children argue.
They did a reprint of the original magazine from January 1984, to mark its 40 year anniversary. It can still be purchased online at https://prodavnica.pcpress.rs/issue/339/1, and they ship internationally. I got my copy a few months ago, wanting to own a small piece of history.
You can buy the actual computer kit as well at https://pcpress.rs/galaksija/, but that one ships only within Serbia.
> "You can buy the actual computer kit as well at https://pcpress.rs/galaksija/, but that one ships only within Serbia."
Even though the website only allows domestic shipping, I suspect (without knowing anything about that country or their culture) that the sort of company which sells a product like that would be pleased enough by the idea that a foreigner wants to buy it that if you contact them there's a good chance they'd be willing to send it internationally if you paid the shipping cost.
The listed price is 8,000 RSD (Serbian Dinars) is equal to ~£57 / ~$74 - so even if the shipping was as expensive as the item itself, it still wouldn't be insanely expensive for someone who really wants it.
There is a good talk about this computer here https://youtu.be/K2chYqir53U, in the vein of similar talks about the commodore 64 and gameboy, that goes very in depth on the inner workings of the galaksija
Didn’t Sinclair ZX80 also use the CPU instead of a video chip?
No, they used a semi-custom chip known as an uncommitted logic array (ULA). It was basically a bunch of building blocks on a die that were designed once for a variety of possible applications, and then reconfigured by the factory to customer's spec. The idea was that most of the design work only needed to be done once, so cranking out customer-specific ASICs was cheaper than a 100% custom design.
Now we have FPGAs, so this approach is pretty much obsolete.
I’m pretty sure Zx80 didn’t have the ULA. Speccy definitely did, not sure about ZX81, though.
A thread about a year ago https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=37850664
https://archive.fo/KAAJC
Off topic question: I'm wondering why you shared this link when the article is on a website that doesn't have a paywall and is big enough that it's not at risk of HN traffic being an effective ddos the way smaller websites can be affected. Just being helpful in case someone in the future finds this thread and the original link is dead?
> How one engineer beat the ban on home computers in socialist Yugoslavia
The title simply isn't true. There was no ban on home computers, just a value limit for an import. And as the article shows, homegrown computers were common.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_computer_systems_from_...
It was not a ban on home computers, so wording is not the best one, but limiting value for an import is effectively a ban. Especially since there was a significant inflation at that time in Yugoslavia. Import limits were defined in dinars, and if it was enough for let's say Commodore 64 with disk drive, monitor and printer when new limit was introduced, the next year it was barely enough for Spectrum, and afterwards not even for that. If I remember correctly (and maybe I don't), Galaksija computer was planned around this limitation - CPU and other components had to be imported but they were below the import limit.
So, in those periods when inflation made importing impossible, there were two main sources of "west" home computers - smuggling, and Yugoslav citizens who went abroad to work for few years were not subject to import limits when returning home with their personal belongings.
General idea behind these limits was to strengthen domestic industry, and your list shows that - plethora of home computers made in Yugoslavia. Unfortunately, these computers were not compatible with anything and with no software they were educational tools at best. That's why no one was buying them except schools and other organizations who had no other choice. It changed a bit with Lira as it was PC compatible, but it came a bit later when Yugoslavia started opening up and these import limits were slowly lifted.
The point here is that in the former Yugoslavia, there was essentially a ban on almost everything, pushing a significant part of the economy into the grey or black market. These bans often felt like the odd attempts of a dysfunctional and decaying system to maintain control. For instance, it was technically illegal to buy foreign currency, yet all valuable assets—like land and houses—were still priced in Deutsche Marks (DMs).
Adding to the irony, nearly a million Yugoslavs worked in Germany as “Gastarbeiter” (guest workers). They acted as unofficial import channels, bringing foreign goods and currency back home.
Interestingly, despite the “restrictions”, there was a vibrant tech scene. Commodore and ZX Spectrum computers were surprisingly common. If I remember correctly, Galaksija actually looked like attempt by government to maintain control - I could be wrong (war might change perspective).
Galaksija was purely enthusiasm of one man (Voja Antonić), with support from Dejan Ristanović and crew gathered around Računari u vašoj kući magazine, who published Galaksija bluprints and instructions, and provided logistic help with boards and parts. It was not in any form government project. If anything, it was intended to fly under the radar. At that time in Yugoslavia, enthusiastic people doing progressive things were more concerned about how to make something work without the government noticing and meddling too much. There were several factory made home computers afterwards in Yugoslavia, and for them we can discuss whether they were encouraged by the government to keep things under control and locally produced, but it should not apply to Galaksija.
It's true from what I can see. They specifically banned the general public from importing any goods worth more than 50 Deutsche Marks (all computers). I'm sure those with connections could get around that and not wind up locked up though but after googling prisons in Yugoslavia I can see why DIY computing became popular.
On one hand, the import value limit effectively did ban home computers, which is why these "homegrown" computers became common as a way around the ban. On the other hand, "a ban on home computers" sounds like an intentional ban on home computing, which is a distortion of both the letter and spirit of the law.
>There was no ban on home computers
Surprising, was there no opposition to russian occupation in Serbia? In Poland there was a strict ban on personal ownership of typewriters, fax machines, copiers, printers, radio transmitters, modems and computers (3 year prison term minimum). CIA was smuggling those to Poland with the help of Church https://www.nytimes.com/1992/02/18/world/reagan-and-pope-rep...
>The report in Time adds many new details, particularly the role of the Central Intelligence Agency and the Roman Catholic Church in opening networks across which telephones, fax machines, printing presses, photocopiers, computers and intelligence information moved to Solidarity.
Personal possession anecdote from book "High-tech behind the Iron Curtain. Electronics, computers and control systems in the Polish People's Republic" ("High-tech za żelazną kurtyną. Elektronika, komputery i systemy sterowania w PRL" 978-83-8098-094-5)
>In 1984, "Informatyka" magazine, involved in the dissemination of these machines, reported on the adventures of Mr. Przemysław, who received in April [...] a package from his brother in Toronto, containing the VIC-20 microcomputer, power supply, cassette recorder, a set of cassettes for television games and English language manual and connecting cables. The Customs Office in Gdynia refused to issue an import license, stating that it could issue [...] only if the computer was necessary for the citizen's professional or scientific work
It slowly got better in second half of the 80s. COCOM relaxed import sanctions in 1984 on low end 8bit gaming machines:
"New Media Behind the Iron Curtain: Cultural History of Video, Microcomputers and Satellite Television in Communist Poland" https://research.utu.fi/converis/getfile?id=51338894&portal=...
>The breakthrough in the domestication of computers in Poland took place in the mid-1980s, most likely between 1984 and 1986. In the global context, this might have been relatively late, but in the context of the Eastern bloc it seems that Poland was within the norm. There are two main reasons behind this chronology: one international, one local. Firstly, on an international level, the embargo on 8-bit technology was relaxed in 1984. Computers had been at the heart of the CoCom debate since the mid-1970s, but – as Mastanduno reports – it was not until July 1984 that the embargo on the most popular 8-bit microcomputers was removed, even though at the same time new restrictions were introduced regarding various telecommunications software and solutions.
In 1985 you could finally legally buy 8bit Atari in Pewex - chain of special shops established to siphon western currency out of the black market.
>Secondly, on a local level, as Kluska reports, in the autumn of 1984, the “[Polish] customs office ceased to make it difficult for citizens to import microcomputer equipment.”
Was there no opposition to Russian occupation in Serbia?
Not really, because it didn't last for any length of time.
I was totally ignorant on the subject of Yugoslawia, and oh wow it managed to come out of Yalta as somewhat independent dictatorship and avoided establishment of USSR military bases on its territory by staying outside of Warsaw Pact.
The whole Eastern Bloc was quite multifaceted. And in its final years, so beautiful. (Those same places are still beautiful now of course, but in different ways).
Thanks for pointing that out! The Guardian is gone to the dogs, since many years now.
I presume downvotes are coming because it turns out that the person I responded to was overstating their case somewhat. I was quick to presume the Guardian was being sloppy again, and that seems to have not been the case here. Fair enough.
[flagged]
The ban wasn't a ban on home computers but rather a ban on foreign imports.
One could argue that it spawned the creativity of domestic creatives who built the home computer anyway with the available resources.
I'm not personally favouring protectionism of this sort but we have to be fair to the thing we're criticizing and there is plenty to say about the Socialist Federal Republic of Yugoslavia without having to resort to claims that they wanted to ban home computers for the sake of it
It was probably a matter of not having enough foreign reserves.
Most likely, as for the same reason seasonal work in the capitalist west was tolerated, even if it couldn't be officially encouraged.
Ironically, protectionism is now the hallmark policy of Trumpists who pretend to be anti-communists.
It'll be interesting to see if protectionism works better for America than Yugoslavia. Domestically, America has a strong free market economy, and it has healthy trading relationships with most other nations. What Trump proposes with China is mostly a geo-political play, and will be done in targeted fashion to restore America's industrial production capacity.
[flagged]
[flagged]
In SFRY?
[flagged]
To be fair, I’ve never seen socialized healthcare conflated with communism. Most people seem to understand the difference.
It’s pretty common in American political discourse. If you look at the discussion around the Affordable Care Act there were tons of predictions that it was the next step on the road to a communist takeover including quoting Lenin and even comparisons to slavery: https://www.baltimoresun.com/2013/10/09/ben-carson-breaks-ne...
Many people know that’s nonsense but there is never a shortage of people willing to lie for political advantage and in that case there was so much money at stake that you could make a political career criticizing the evils of socialized medicine.
I'm in the UK. Our healthcare is socialised.
My elderly nan had a fall this morning and has badly hurt her back. She has been lying on the floor in her house since this morning (six hours so far), immobile, waiting for an ambulance to arrive. I wish I lived near her so I could help. She needs an ambulance unfortunately as she literally cannot move - she is in terrible pain.
When/if the ambulance finally does arrive, it will take her to a crowded, failing hospital where she will probably have to wait several more hours before being seen by an underpaid and overstretched nurse in a miserable ward.
Our system is failing, and not because it is underfunded (it gets nearly £200 billion a year and it has had real-terms increases in funding for decades, and employs 2M people). It is failing because:
* it is monolithic and unwieldy
* it has no efficiency incentives
* it is a state monopoly, so it is able to underpay and poorly treat its staff
* politicians are not the right people to preside over healthcare
* it is considered our national religion, and it doesn't get the scrutiny it deserves
The European public/private model provides much better quality and outcomes. The American system, expensive though it is, provides far better quality and outcomes.
What's it like having never heard a republican talk about public healthcare?
I'm a republican who is also opposed to public healthcare and I understand it isn't communism. Most of the other republicans with whom I interact also understand that. Not all republicans engage in false equivalence.
> To be fair, I’ve never seen socialized healthcare conflated with communism.
> I'm a republican who is also opposed to public healthcare and I understand it isn't communism
You know that guy who leads your party? Large, orange, shouty? He's conflated it with communism, repeatedly. You should perhaps consider paying more attention.
I think for myself and do not just adopt whatever view happens to be espoused by a party leader. I'm sure he may have conflated socialized healthcare with communism at some point, but my original point remains that most of the republicans I know do not believe such things.
> but my original point remains that most of the republicans I know do not believe such things.
That's _a little different_ to the original claim never to have seen it conflated with communism.
The point also remains that I haven't seen socialized healthcare conflated with communism. While it wouldn't surprise me if Trump said it, I have not personally seen it.
I mean, Trump has accused Harris of having a "far-left agenda" and of being a "Marxist", when at best she would be center, center-left to an European eye.
Again, to be fair, she proposed (though now rescinded I believe) price controls on food.
That's not really "far-left" or "Marxist", at least in my book. But then again, I'm not American. At some point, I believe Trump also proposed some pretty aggressive protectionist policies concerning foreign imports.
Trump did indeed propose some protectionist policies concerning foreign imports. It was oddly left leaning. Makes me wonder if the parties are switching platforms again.
Some of her platform like the race-based "forgivable loans", etc. is very far-left - even in Europe.
> ...when at best she would be center, center-left to an European eye.
You must understand something about her platform and policies, I sure don't. She hasn't said much of substance. All the bitching between the two of them is like watching my children argue.
That is true, but her party's economic policies have been consistently neoliberalist in the recent past.
Came to the comment section for the socialist cope “well actually”
Apologists for socialism will state the usual: "But that wasn't /real/ socialism"
Socialists tend to believe that real socialism hasn't been tried properly yet. That's how they explain the litany of failure.
And if anyone wants to try the "but Scandinavia is socialist and look how great they are" trope then bring it on...